My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

Spregovori

Spregovori
Posts: 69
Join date: 2010-04-09

• Post n°43

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

Spregovori Yesterday at 3:20 pm

Not necessary lies, i am not accusing you of lying. It was meant more as an inside look into something "bad/dirty" (which seems to be a general outside perception) and not fully understood, read by those with no reference or prior experience to actually be able to make credible comments or provide some benefit to the overall debate. In-fact, they "already know".

Understanding or not understanding something ofc has not connection to whether or not that something is correct or valid.

No, not your mind. Have i worded it so wrongly? Could it be a language barrier?

The cheering part was relating to a "crowd consciousness", should have been more specific i guess and no it did not offend me. Cant see why you think it could do that. Rarely anything does.


You are free to share your thoughts and experiences with people in any place. The only thing here is that, you were not asked to do it. It was of your own volition and as a forum member you have this "right" and ability to do so.


Speculation by itself implies an error. Be it in judgement or the methods or both. People will be informed and will make their own minds? People (had) already made their own minds even before this thread here. They did not ask you to inform them, this goes for the lurkers too. What you write might give confirmation to what they think - parts they agree with, the rest will be ignored.


Despondency is, curiously, fairly common these days and i would not say thuban itself is a cause for that. I would say people with an already preexisting condition seek out what might give them something new, something different, some glimmer of hope or just simply something to play around with in their minds. How thuban might affect their condition can not be generalized.

Thuban ofc is not the only thing which lures in. A forum, such as this one (or Gaia or PA), can do that to.

Many just simply wish for a "change". Myself included.
Wishing and/or hoping is ofc a no good - passive.

Without the sex part thuban would have a chance to not just be a group but a movement. Just a thought, not relevant to the topic. I will go along with your stance and will not touch upon the details.


The relationship was/is fluid. I would even argue it was formed outside (independently) of thuban but later incorporated into it. The neon signs...well as you know there are quite some things i loudly protested about and never agreed to or wanted to go along with.


Well yes his reactions, in regard to women, were that of a human male.


By less words i meant my own post as it contained copy pastes after that part.


If it is related to demiurge (Enlil), which is to be the false god, the pretender god, the christian bible god, the jewish god...one hidden branch (of the two)....same father, different mother... If you say thuban is in its service...then how is it off topic?

SuiGeneris wrote:
Yes of course. And if i forget any detail please remind me.



Might be the right timet for me to say that...and you can correct me if i am wrong...that:

- you in general agree with the thuban databank since it is not the thuban databank as you say, it is merely borrowed existing data put under a thuban label

- there is an agenda behind if, for which you say is not what it is claimed. you say the agenda is actually a reptilian one (be it a memeplex or a real one)

- what you dislike most about thuban is how this databank is being used/applied

- the sexuality itself is also not a problem for you, the problem is (again) the usage of it

- what you also dislike is how you personally were treated, which is also what caused you to slam the door and you also never liked how others (those on the inside and outside) were treated, you dislike the management

- what you wish to keep people away from is them being misused to fuel the archetypes thuban stands for, you wish to strip thuban of its meta power and you hope posting here (or like this) can help achieve that



I am sorry if i seem to be in opposition to you. I am not.

 

Sanicle

Sanicle
Posts: 1743
Join date: 2011-02-28
Location: Melbourne, Australia

• Post n°44

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

Sanicle Today at 2:22 am

I would like to say at this point that I think some Thubans may have a slightly skewed perception of how those who didn’t get involved may view the whole belief system and the activities therein, especially in relation to it being seen generally as “bad/dirty”. I think that assumption is unfair and fits in with the view so often expressed by TR in the blogs they posted here that those who don’t go along with it all are stupid Nabsers (or whatever the term was) who are just too tied up in memes to comprehend it all. Thubans know as little of us as individuals as we know of them and should no more assume than we do.

Speaking for myself, my main objection was mainly to the pedantic nature of it which fits in with the ‘my way is the only way’ mindset, just like so many belief systems out there. My perception is that the consciousness (from individual to planetary etc) is like a sun in miniature, with each ray being a potential pathway (which can become a belief system) for us to explore which becomes ‘lit up’ when we achieve enlightenment along the way (to over-simplify it). Within that image it can be seen that there are ‘opposite’ pathways that need to be explored (as Sui’s cool list expressed), indeed pathways at every angle from that centre of perception, along with those that run alongside that we can also choose to step into, and each one is as valid as another if we are to achieve a ‘fully rounded’/universal ability to Be. I could go on and on about how this symbology can be applied to every realm and dimension the consciousness can explore along those rays in any of various bodies, but what I’ve stated exemplifies my point I think as regards there being no one ‘right’ and ‘only’ pathway as we continue to evolve in this way.

I could also tell you about my own experiences with dragons (one of which has been my best friend for years in the astral realms) and reptilians (in various stages of evolution) which don’t fit with the Thuban perspective yet which have proven to be valuable to me during my own journeying. I could tell you that my current mentor claims to be an angel and that when I asked him if he is Anunnaki he replied that he is “Anunna no more”, reminding me that humans are not the only ones who evolve. (Another human-ego based assumption, that dragons and humans are still the same as they were thousands of years ago when they were first described?) I’ve also experienced the sex thing involving astral energies and can confirm that it is much more torrid and erotic than that which is normally experienced here in the physical with another partner.

But let me go back to my angel friend. He gave me another perception of the reptilian/human interface, as per the “We are you” claim the Thuban dragons make. I’ve known for some time that I’ve had a ‘past life (or lives?)’ as a reptilian being. I even know my reptilian name. But this is the general human way of seeing things through the veil of time. In the angel’s view (like so many others) all lives are occurring now and each ‘incarnation’ is an aspect of our ‘higher selves’ made manifest in various dimensions of experience. He put it to me that the reptilians that are challenging we humans are actually aspects of ourselves, serving our overall evolution by doing so. In this case the predator/prey dynamic, among others, is being explored but that they mainly do so from the subtle realms has its obvious benefits as well.

One last point. I don’t care who claims to have played with genetics to ‘create’ we humans, they only manipulated the matter/bodies we choose to incarnate into. WE ARE NOT OUR BODIES, so they have NO ownership of or jurisdiction over who we are or what we do. And it certainly doesn’t give them the right to ‘eat’ or ‘possess’ us because we have something they want.

Above and beyond all of that, of course, is the question of whether all that we experience as voices and images, etc. in our heads is come from deep within our own unconscious, or if the beings we perceive are merely empowered tulpas and egregore humans have created themselves that exist as maybe the sum total of our astral realms for us to work through.

The Sun image though is why I study everyone's inner world experiences I come across, which included the Thuban material, looking for and often finding more pieces to fit my own 'puzzle' on my pathway to understanding, rejecting none of it outright. Hearing someone, like you Sui and Spregovori, who fully explored it and held onto their own perceptions and principles throughout is, to my mind, a gift you are giving to those of us who didn't have the time, energy or inclination to. Again, I thank you for sharing those here.

 

Spregovori

Spregovori
Posts: 70
Join date: 2010-04-09

• Post n°45

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

Spregovori Today at 2:25 pm

Sanicle wrote:​

I would like to say at this point that I think some Thubans may have a slightly skewed perception of how those who didn’t get involved may view the whole belief system and the activities therein, especially in relation to it being seen generally as “bad/dirty”. I think that assumption is unfair and fits in with the view so often expressed by TR in the blogs they posted here that those who don’t go along with it all are stupid Nabsers (or whatever the term was) who are just too tied up in memes to comprehend it all. Thubans know as little of us as individuals as we know of them and should no more assume than we do.​

Ok you have a point here. Communication problems.

Here is my view (some fairly generalized examples) on all of it, a brief summary of what hits the fan when you talk to someone. Be it past thuban statements, be it my posting in this thread, be it this very reply to you, be it posting of others in this thread and on this forum (and others) overall

All the dung that was ever thrown at anyone by anyone (thuban included)... I will borrow from the "common types" so some of this will be familiar.

This is what can be seen every day, when you hear people talking, when you read peoples exchanges

---

+ - (superiority stance, you are all stupid)


I am ok as long as [condition], if not => - +

I am better because "my skin is white", "my kids have good grades in school", "i was promoted at work", "i do not subject myself to the system", "i am not a sheeple", "i have a better understanding", "my experiences are more far reaching"

---

- + (inferiority stance, others are great but i am stupid)



Weak points.

I lack because i do not have [reason]. I am no good because "i have no money", "live in this place", "have this lineage", "my nose is too big",...

---

- - (depressive, passive stance, i am stupid but you are no better, in fact it is all crap)


Apathy.

---

+ + (reality stance, i am ok, problems are solved via non conflicting attitude)


I am ok as long as [condition], if not => - +
Others are ok as long as [condition], if not => + -

I am ok but not perfect, others are people too and are allowed to be and to love themselves. Yet not always things are fine and peachy. The world is not "nirvana, love everything and everyone".

---

Problematic speaker:

boar, outer face + - (inner face - +)
tiger, outer face + - (inner face + - )
camel, outer face + - (inner face - + )
skunk, outer face + - (inner face - +/ + -)
bunny, outer face - + (inner face - +)
clamp, outer face - + / - - (inner face - + / - -)



boar: hi i came here to your store to see the crap you are selling, i am here to again have the benefit of your incompetent services, you do not get it since you are all dumb little sheeple wake up already...

Rude type. Rude no matter what or where.

workaround: focus on the main content, overhear everything else, do not discuss with the boar about it being wrong or right

you: what are you looking for (to buy), what service in specific do you need...

compliment from the boar: ok i will buy this, you still sell crap, but less of a crap than the other store

---

camel: my name is dr.Gustav Something, specialist of mechatronics, i did my phd at Cambridge, now i am here to seek advice (help), see my car broke down and i read this thesis about the combustion the other day so i think it is this and that and ....


Always smarter than you type, always more knowing.


workaround: be up to date on your profession, acknowledge their actual knowledge, acknowledge title, give praise for what they actually deserve, do not directly confront with camel about it being wrong

you: oh i see you are informed about this and that, lets see about your car, this is a good question you ask allow me to answer you...

---

tiger: i have been waiting here in check out line for far longer than acceptable, the room has bad ventilation and your service overall is completely behind times , let me tell you how this should have been done...

Angry types, angry whenever something is not as tiger wants it to be. Otherwise ok.


workaround: acknowledge the tiger, when tiger comes to the check out you tell him "let us do this quickly since i know your time is important", do not argue with the tiger

---

skunk: no one can be trusted, is it true what he just said, where does that say (where is that written)

I am ok as long as i am not deceived.

workaround: patience, take time, answer skunk what it asks or needs to know, do not be in a hurry, do not refuse its questions

---

bunny: hi i need a new library card since i have lost it while i was out the other day, i went to watch this great romantic comedy and it was so much like when i went to Paris back when i was younger oh we had so many good days then ,did you know that the fashion at the time was something really special i mean just look at the...

I am ok as long as i can talk and am being heard.

workaround: when bunny runs out of breath, ask a content focused question...repeat, do not ask non content specific questions, do not point out its bla bla bla when you are done bunny will want to keep talking, try your best to use some valid excuse or arrange to be "called away" in advance if you know the bunny is coming.

---

clamp: hi (looking down or past you) i am here about the permit...(silence)

I am ok as long as i do not have to communicate and am left alone.

Clamp is a bunny opposite.

workaround: communicate via statements, as little questions as possible, always respect the personal space which in case of a clamp is much larger than usual


P.S


You never get only one type. There is a lot of cross-breading.​

​

Last edited by Spregovori on Sun Jan 10, 2016 2:32 pm; edited 1 time in total

 

Carol


Carol
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Posts: 16009
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• Post n°46

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

Carol Today at 2:32 pm

Why bother with labels to begin with?



_________________
What is life?
It is the flash of a firefly in the night, the breath of a buffalo in the wintertime. It is the little shadow which runs across the grass and loses itself in the sunset.
With deepest respect ~ Aloha & Mahalo, Carol

mudra

mudra
Posts: 17044
Join date: 2010-04-09
Age: 61
Location: belgium

• Post n°47

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

mudra Today at 4:16 pm
Spregovori ,

Exuse me if I don't copy paste your last post here for it is quite a long one and what comes to mind reading it is related to the different ideas you expressed in it.

I would like to say these traits you are describing are quite human aren't they ? All stemming from self reflection pertaining to different levels rooted on the idea one may have of self importance .
What we must realize is that we are not humans per se nor are we aliens either for that matter. As Sanicle says we are not our bodies. Nor are we our minds nor any identity we use as a label to define ourselves.
The core essence is a conveyor for spirit to manifest . As spiritual beings we have fluidity that allows us to see several points of view at once and hence to know in the now. Whereas when we operate from a level of self importance we fix ourselves on a point in the mind that has a time tag to it where beliefs are created blinding ourselves from seeing things on a wide angle as they really are. The more we fix ourselves the more we step away from primordial fluidity. Spiritual beings are not located in time, space, matter or energy unless they consider themselves to be by own will or by force. But the moment we remember of our true nature fluidity of being is restored.
So we may explore many paths, perceive on different levels , we may find friends or enemies on the way, take as many viewpoints as we wish, expand or shrink ourselves in the process of doing so , we may even give up and fall in utter apathy at times or at other times feel all powerful ... but all that is really of any value is the power we gather in the knowing that the realm of spirit is where we belong always. Depending on how much we may from actual experience be in the knowing or not knowing of this our perceptions change accordingly.


Fluidity



Love from me
mudra

Sanicle

Sanicle
Posts: 1744
Join date: 2011-02-28
Location: Melbourne, Australia

• Post n°48

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

Sanicle Today at 12:00 am

Spregovori

Yes, the way people communicate can be an issue but what I was trying to say is that we can all just share and learn from each other if we don’t let ego issues and differences of opinion, thus individual perspectives, get in the way of doing so. It takes time and effort (ie lots of communication) to fully understand why another may disagree with you when we only have words to use on a forum to express ourselves and all those types you mentioned may have something important to say if you take the time to really ‘listen’ rather than make superficial assumptions and dismiss them outright based only on those. I would think labelling them (and possible dismissing them on that basis?) would be a block to really hearing what was being said, thus maybe missing whatever gems they may impart. And that is why I love being a member of this forum, especially when actual discussion is taking place as on this thread.

As regards “what hits the fan” IMO a bit of healthy debate can only hurt us if we let it. If we are ‘shielded’ from it by not taking what’s said personally and keep a sense of humour we can learn a lot about all parties involved, including ourselves.

In a further attempt to explain where I’m coming from, a short story. In a meditation I did some years ago I was approaching what I perceived to be my Higher Self. I was given three images. The first was of a toddler, reaching out towards our world with curiosity. The second was of a young adult, his whole visage expressing compassion for what he was witnessing below in our world. The third was of an old man, laughing gently at what he saw, his sense of humour about the mad situations we get ourselves in uppermost.

I was born curious haha, gaining a balanced sense of compassion wasn't so hard after I got out of my own way (ie depression resulting from exercising my curiosity and finding out how the world really is) and I'm still working on the humour bit.

**********************************************************************************​

Mudra

I love those gifs you’ve used on this thread. So cute!


Sanicle

Sanicle
Posts: 1745
Join date: 2011-02-28
Location: Melbourne, Australia

• Post n°49

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

Sanicle Today at 10:56 am

I apologize if I've said anything to offend or upset you Sui.

 

orthodoxymoron

orthodoxymoron
Posts: 6685
Join date: 2010-09-28

• Post n°50

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

orthodoxymoron Today at 3:25 pm

​

Carol wrote:
Awesome post Sanicle and good tip about closing the door.

One of the things I've notice after Tony and Raven were banned (closing the door to that active energy on the forum where they would also constantly spam other member's threads) is the increase in internet traffic, posting and membership.

Sui, I truly appreciate your courage in all of this and sharing your story as this has cleared up quite a few questions I've had regarding Tony's relationship with the dragons. Pretty much anyone can learn how to go into an altered state of consciousness and channel some type of entity from another dimension.. and subsequently become self-delusional believing everything that is channeled. One just needs to keep in mind the TRICKSTER element in these types of communications.

"In mythology, and in the study of folklore and religion, a trickster is a character in a story (god, goddess, spirit, man, woman, or anthropomorphisation), which exhibits a great degree of intellect or secret knowledge, and uses it to play tricks or otherwise disobey normal rules and conventional behaviour."

Lewis Hyde describes the Trickster as a "boundary-crosser".[2] The Trickster crosses both physical and often breaks societal rules. Tricksters "...violate principles of social and natural order, playfully disrupting normal life and then re-establishing it on a new basis."[3]

Read more about tricksters at this link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trickster​

Carol wrote:

orthodoxymoron wrote:​

Try watching the first-four episodes of the 2009-10 version of "V" -- without a break -- followed immediately by the "Unholy Alliance" episode from the second-season. The effect should be quite chilling. It wouldn't surprise me if Earth turns out to be some sort of a "V" Genetics-Laboratory (going way, way, way back). I liked the best aspects of Anna and the "V's" -- and HATED the worst aspects. I'm honestly a "V" -- and I'm related to "Anna". I often feel somewhat like a "Chad Dekker" character (with my meek-demeanor and incessant-questioning). I wonder why "V" got cancelled after only two seasons?? I also wonder what a third season would've been like?! I liked the general idea behind "V" -- but I thought the plot was weak and disjointed. It was impressive -- but it could've been SO Much Better. A few years ago, I could've attended a $100 Dinner at a "V" Celebrity's Home -- but I was broke -- so I didn't go. I wonder what a combination of Stargate SG-1 -- Babylon 5 -- Jupiter Ascending -- Guardians of the Galaxy -- Ex Machina -- and "V" might be like?!​

In reading up on "V" it was mentioned that it cost one million per episode so costs were likely a factor. However, I too thought the story plot weak and continued to get worse as time went on. I did watch SG-1, Jupiter Ascending, Guardians of the Galaxy.. loved SG-1 with all of the science and Jupiter Ascending. Thought Guardians of the Galaxy a bit hokey. "V" got more gruesome as the story plot evolved. Haven't viewed Ex Machina yet. SG-! is more on target as this likely exists within the Secret Government. Jupiter Ascending was more along the lines of harvesting the essence of the human body / souls.. from different planets where the so-called elite converted to use as a substance to emerge themselves in for rejuvenation and ever lasting youth. However, one could easily see that they valued "time" having a long life looking beautiful as compared to spiritual evolvement. In fact, they were very attached to materialism and maintaining their elitism. The humanoids from that particular system interfaced with reptilians and both species were without compassion.. except for the winged hybrids and Jupiter Jones. Hers was a story of awakening to what has real meaning in life. Ones personal relationships and protecting humanity.

Future series.. ahh.. one could go in a multitude of directions when focusing on Sci Fi. Some of what I know to be true is too awful to view. Sean David Morton wrote a book, Sands of Time, which is probably more on target for what is going on with some of the negative types of ET on the planet. I'd probably like to see a cross between SG-! (jump room to different planets/dimensions), Dr. Steven Greer, Sean David Morton and Dolores Cannon. Something along the lines of Ex Machina should be included but where they assist humanity in it's evolution and cleaning up the planet's pollution.​

Carol wrote:
"Hive mind" with respect to ants and bees insure the survival of their species. They work together and share in one consciousness. This is also similar to where suddenly a flock of birds take off and fly in one direction and a similar situation with fish where schools travel in one direction and then all turn together. There is a sense of comfort when working along members who are joined in the same "consciousness" frequency.

Ironically, after a kundalini experience, I discovered I enjoyed my aloneness where my thoughts could travel outward without interruption (bumping into the thought energy of others) or dwell within at that inner quiet peaceful place undisturbed.

Having someone's negative emotions or something (inter dimensional entity intrude) felt invasive. The desire for alone time was something that came about after being a parent and in public service for years and years.

During my 20s, for entertainment relaxation, I would use the colleges' sensory deprivation room to practice meditation in. It was refreshing to block out all external sound and work on expanding consciousness via meditation.

Enjoy your break B.B. I probably would have banned Tony and Raven for all the spamming on other people's heads that they did a long time ago if Mercurial has been around to help out. As it was, with spinal stenosis, bone spurs and a disc pressing into my spinal cord creating havoc (significant nerve damage) along with a great deal of pain, it was difficult to cope with the basics at home, so I spent less and less time participating in the forum. Surgery was on Oct 1st and all is good again.

It appears others are feeling more chatty as well - which is a good sign. ​

Sanicle wrote:
I would like to say at this point that I think some Thubans may have a slightly skewed perception of how those who didn’t get involved may view the whole belief system and the activities therein, especially in relation to it being seen generally as “bad/dirty”. I think that assumption is unfair and fits in with the view so often expressed by TR in the blogs they posted here that those who don’t go along with it all are stupid Nabsers (or whatever the term was) who are just too tied up in memes to comprehend it all. Thubans know as little of us as individuals as we know of them and should no more assume than we do.

Speaking for myself, my main objection was mainly to the pedantic nature of it which fits in with the ‘my way is the only way’ mindset, just like so many belief systems out there. My perception is that the consciousness (from individual to planetary etc) is like a sun in miniature, with each ray being a potential pathway (which can become a belief system) for us to explore which becomes ‘lit up’ when we achieve enlightenment along the way (to over-simplify it). Within that image it can be seen that there are ‘opposite’ pathways that need to be explored (as Sui’s cool list expressed), indeed pathways at every angle from that centre of perception, along with those that run alongside that we can also choose to step into, and each one is as valid as another if we are to achieve a ‘fully rounded’/universal ability to Be. I could go on and on about how this symbology can be applied to every realm and dimension the consciousness can explore along those rays in any of various bodies, but what I’ve stated exemplifies my point I think as regards there being no one ‘right’ and ‘only’ pathway as we continue to evolve in this way.

I could also tell you about my own experiences with dragons (one of which has been my best friend for years in the astral realms) and reptilians (in various stages of evolution) which don’t fit with the Thuban perspective yet which have proven to be valuable to me during my own journeying. I could tell you that my current mentor claims to be an angel and that when I asked him if he is Anunnaki he replied that he is “Anunna no more”, reminding me that humans are not the only ones who evolve. (Another human-ego based assumption, that dragons and humans are still the same as they were thousands of years ago when they were first described?) I’ve also experienced the sex thing involving astral energies and can confirm that it is much more torrid and erotic than that which is normally experienced here in the physical with another partner.

But let me go back to my angel friend. He gave me another perception of the reptilian/human interface, as per the “We are you” claim the Thuban dragons make. I’ve known for some time that I’ve had a ‘past life (or lives?)’ as a reptilian being. I even know my reptilian name. But this is the general human way of seeing things through the veil of time. In the angel’s view (like so many others) all lives are occurring now and each ‘incarnation’ is an aspect of our ‘higher selves’ made manifest in various dimensions of experience. He put it to me that the reptilians that are challenging we humans are actually aspects of ourselves, serving our overall evolution by doing so. In this case the predator/prey dynamic, among others, is being explored but that they mainly do so from the subtle realms has its obvious benefits as well.

One last point. I don’t care who claims to have played with genetics to ‘create’ we humans, they only manipulated the matter/bodies we choose to incarnate into. WE ARE NOT OUR BODIES, so they have NO ownership of or jurisdiction over who we are or what we do. And it certainly doesn’t give them the right to ‘eat’ or ‘possess’ us because we have something they want.

Above and beyond all of that, of course, is the question of whether all that we experience as voices and images, etc. in our heads is come from deep within our own unconscious, or if the beings we perceive are merely empowered tulpas and egregore humans have created themselves that exist as maybe the sum total of our astral realms for us to work through.

The Sun image though is why I study everyone's inner world experiences I come across, which included the Thuban material, looking for and often finding more pieces to fit my own 'puzzle' on my pathway to understanding, rejecting none of it outright. Hearing someone, like you Sui and Spregovori, who fully explored it and held onto their own perceptions and principles throughout is, to my mind, a gift you are giving to those of us who didn't have the time, energy or inclination to. Again, I thank you for sharing those here.

​

I deeply appreciate the comments quoted above -- and I learn a HUGE amount from forum-members BUT I continue to be VERY Disappointed that the "Awake and Aware" don't wish to discuss Sacred-Scripture in any significant and meaningful manner. I've taken a "Walk on the Wild-Side" on this website -- but no-one seems to wish to take a "Walk on My-Side". In addition to studying Job through Isaiah side-by-side with Luke through Jude -- consider the following two KJV Biblical-Groups:

First-Group:

1. Genesis.
2. Exodus.
3. Leviticus.
4. Numbers.
5. Deuteronomy.
6. Matthew.
7. Mark.
8. Luke.
9. John.
10. Acts.
11. Revelation.

Second-Group:

1. Genesis.
2. Job.
3. Psalms.
4. Proverbs.
5. Ecclesiastes.
6. Song of Solomon.
7. Isaiah.
8. Jeremiah.
9. Lamentations.
10. Ezekiel.
11. Daniel.

What's really going-on here?? Notice especially the matter of Ethics and Law. It might be VERY Interesting to witness a debate between proponents of each group!! Try reading these two groups side-by-side (straight-through -- over and over). What would a Peale and Schuller version of each group look like??!! What would strict Grammatical-Historical Hermeneutics reveal?? What if the New-Testament had been a Commentary on the Second-Group?? I honestly want to "Move-On" BUT there seems to be a hell of a lot of unfinished historical-business. What if Ellen White had written a book (or two books) covering each of these two groups??

Consider the Church of England. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_of_England The Church of England is the established Christian church[2][3][4] in England and the mother church of the worldwide Anglican Communion.

The church dates its establishment to the 6th-century Gregorian mission in Kent led by St Augustine.[5][6] The English church renounced papal authority when Henry VIII broke with Rome to secure an annulment from Catherine of Aragon in the 1530s.[7] The English Reformation accelerated under Edward VI's regents before a brief restoration of Catholicism under Queen Mary I and Philip II of Spain. The Act of Supremacy of 1558 renewed the breach and the Elizabethan Settlement charted a course whereby the English church was to be both Catholic and Reformed:
Catholic in that it views itself as a part of the universal church of Jesus Christ in unbroken continuity with the early apostolic church. This is expressed in its emphasis on the teachings of the early Church Fathers, as formalised in the Apostles', Nicene, and Athanasian creeds.[8]
Reformed in that it has been shaped by some of the doctrinal principles of the 16th-century Protestant Reformation, in particular in the Thirty-Nine Articles of Religion and the Book of Common Prayer.[8][page needed][not in citation given]

In the earlier phase of the Reformation there were Catholic martyrs but some radical Protestants were martyred as well. The later phases saw the Penal Laws punish both Catholic and nonconforming Protestants. In the 17th century, political and religious disputes raised the Puritan and Presbyterian faction to control of the church, but this ended with the Restoration. Papal recognition of George III in 1766 led to greater religious tolerance.

Since the Reformation, the Church of England has used an English liturgy. The church contains several doctrinal strands, the main three known as Anglo-Catholic, Evangelical and Broad Church. Tensions between theological conservatives and progressives find expression in debates over the ordination of women and homosexuality. Presently, Archbishop Justin Welby represents a moderate position on issues related to human sexuality, and, while the Church of England does not currently allow same-sex weddings, Archbishop Welby does endorse civil gay marriage and does endorse prayer ceremonies to mark the occasion for same-sex couples.[9]

The governing structure of the church is based on dioceses, each presided over by a bishop. Within each diocese are local parishes. The Archbishop of Canterbury is the Primate of All England, leading the Church of England and acting as a focus of unity for the wider Anglican Communion. The Supreme Governor of the Church of England is the British monarch, currently Elizabeth II, whose role is largely ceremonial. The General Synod is the legislative body for the church and comprises bishops, other clergy and laity. Its measures must be approved by both Houses of Parliament.

According to tradition, Christianity arrived in Britain in the 1st or 2nd century, during which time southern Britain became part of the Roman Empire. The earliest historical evidence of Christianity among the native Britons is found in the writings of such early Christian Fathers as Tertullian and Origen in the first years of the 3rd century. Three Romano-British bishops, including Restitutus, are known to have been present at the Council of Arles in 314.[10] Others attended the Council of Sardica in 347 and that of Ariminum in 360, and a number of references to the church in Roman Britain are found in the writings of 4th century Christian fathers. Britain was the home of Pelagius, who opposed Augustine of Hippo's doctrine of original sin.[11]

While Christianity was long established as the religion of the Britons at the time of the Anglo-Saxon invasion, Christian Britons made little progress in converting the newcomers from their native paganism. Consequently, in 597, Pope Gregory I sent the prior of the Abbey of St Andrew's (later canonised as Augustine of Canterbury) from Rome to evangelise the Angles. This event is known as the Gregorian mission and is the date the Church of England generally marks as the beginning of its formal history. With the help of Christians already residing in Kent, Augustine established his church at Canterbury, the capital of the Kingdom of Kent, and became the first in the series of Archbishops of Canterbury in 598. A later archbishop, the Greek Theodore of Tarsus, also contributed to the organisation of Christianity in England.

While some Celtic Christian practices were changed at the Synod of Whitby, the Christian Church in the British Isles was under papal authority from earliest times.[12] Queen Bertha of Kent was among the Christians in England who recognised papal authority before Augustine arrived[13] and Celtic Christians were carrying out missionary work with papal approval long before the Synod of Whitby.

The Synod of Whitby established the Roman date for Easter and the Roman style of monastic tonsure in Britain. This meeting of the ecclesiastics with Roman customs with local bishops was summoned in 664 at Saint Hilda's double monastery of Streonshalh (Streanæshalch), later called Whitby Abbey. It was presided over by King Oswiu, who did not engage in the debate but made the final ruling.

In 1534, King Henry VIII separated the English Church from Rome.[7] A theological separation had been foreshadowed by various movements within the English Church such as Lollardy, but the English Reformation gained political support when Henry VIII wanted an annulment of his marriage to Catherine of Aragon so he could marry Anne Boleyn. Pope Clement VII, considering that the earlier marriage had been entered under a papal dispensation and how Catherine's nephew, Emperor Charles V, might react to such a move, refused the annulment. Eventually, Henry, although theologically opposed to Protestantism, took the position of Supreme Head of the Church of England to ensure the annulment of his marriage. He was excommunicated by Pope Paul III.[14]

In 1536–40 Henry VIII engaged in the Dissolution of the Monasteries, which controlled much of the richest land. He disbanded monasteries, priories, convents and friaries in England, Wales and Ireland, appropriated their income, disposed of their assets, and provided pensions for the former residents. The properties were sold to pay for the wars. Bernard argues:
The dissolution of the monasteries in the late 1530s was one of the most revolutionary events in English history. There were nearly 900 religious houses in England, around 260 for monks, 300 for regular canons, 142 nunneries and 183 friaries; some 12,000 people in total, 4,000 monks, 3,000 canons, 3,000 friars and 2,000 nuns....one adult man in fifty was in religious orders.[15]
Henry maintained a strong preference for traditional Catholic practices and, during his reign, Protestant reformers were unable to make many changes to the practices of the Church of England. Indeed, this part of Henry's reign saw the trial for heresy of Protestants as well as Roman Catholics.

Under his son, King Edward VI, more Protestant-influenced forms of worship were adopted. Under the leadership of the Archbishop of Canterbury, Thomas Cranmer, a more radical reformation proceeded. A new pattern of worship was set out in the Book of Common Prayer (1549 and 1552). These were based on the older liturgy but influenced by Protestant principles. The confession of the reformed Church of England was set out in the Forty-two Articles (later revised to thirty-nine). The reformation however was cut short by the death of the king. Queen Mary I, who succeeded him, returned England again to the authority of the papacy, thereby ending the first attempt at an independent Church of England. During her co-reign with her husband, King Philip, many leaders and common people were burnt for their refusal to recant of their reformed faith. These are known as the Marian martyrs and the persecution led to her nickname of "Bloody Mary".

Mary also died childless and so it was left to the new regime of her half-sister Elizabeth to resolve the direction of the church. The settlement under Queen Elizabeth I (from 1558), known as the Elizabethan Settlement, developed the via media (middle way) character of the Church of England, a church moderately Reformed in doctrine, as expressed in the Thirty-Nine Articles, but also emphasising continuity with the Catholic and Apostolic traditions of the Church Fathers. It was also an established church (constitutionally established by the state with the head of state as its supreme governor). The exact nature of the relationship between church and state would be a source of continued friction into the next century.

For the next century, through the reigns of James I, who ordered the creation of what became known as the King James Bible,[16] and Charles I, culminating in the English Civil War and the Protectorate of Oliver Cromwell, there were significant swings back and forth between two factions: the Puritans (and other radicals) who sought more far-reaching Protestant reforms, and the more conservative churchmen who aimed to keep closer to traditional beliefs and Catholic practices. The failure of political and ecclesiastical authorities to submit to Puritan demands for more extensive reform was one of the causes of open warfare. By Continental standards, the level of violence over religion was not high, but the casualties included King Charles I and Archbishop of Canterbury William Laud. Under the Commonwealth and the Protectorate of England from 1649 to 1660, the bishops were dethroned and former practices were outlawed, and Presbyterian ecclesiology was introduced in place of the episcopate. The 39 Articles were replaced by the Westminster Confession, the Book of Common Prayer by the Directory of Public Worship. Despite this, about one quarter of English clergy refused to conform to this form of State Presbyterianism.

With the Restoration of Charles II, Parliament restored the Church of England to a form not far removed from the Elizabethan version. One difference was that the ideal of encompassing all the people of England in one religious organisation, taken for granted by the Tudors, had to be abandoned. The religious landscape of England assumed its present form, with the Anglican established church occupying the middle ground, and those Puritans and Protestants who dissented from the Anglican establishment, and Roman Catholics, too strong to be suppressed altogether, having to continue their existence outside the National Church rather than controlling it. Continuing official suspicion and legal restrictions continued well into the 19th century.

By the Fifth Article of the Union with Ireland 1800, the Church of England and Church of Ireland were united into "one Protestant Episcopal church, to be called, the United Church of England and Ireland".[17] Although this union was declared "an essential and fundamental Part of the Union",[18] the Irish Church Act 1869 separated the Irish part of the church again and disestablished it, the Act coming into effect on 1 January 1871.

As the British Empire expanded, British colonists and colonial administrators took the established church doctrines and practices together with ordained ministry and formed overseas branches of the Church of England. As they developed or, beginning with the United States of America, became sovereign and/or independent states many of their churches became separate organizationally but remained linked to the Church of England through the Anglican Communion.

Under the guidance of Rowan Williams and with significant pressure from clergy union representatives, the ecclesiastical penalty for convicted felons to be defrocked was set aside from the Clergy Discipline Measure 2003. The clergy union argued that the penalty was unfair to victims of hypothetical miscarriages of criminal justice, because the ecclesiastical penalty is considered irreversible. Although clerics can still be banned for life from ministry, they remain ordained as priests and continue to draw salaries or pensions.[19]

The archbishops of Canterbury and York warned in January 2015 that the Church of England will no longer be able to carry on in its current form unless the downward spiral in membership is somehow reversed as typical Sunday attendances have halved to 800,000 in the last 40 years:[20]

The urgency of the challenge facing us is not in doubt. Attendance at Church of England services has declined at an average of one per cent per annum over recent decades and, in addition, the age profile of our membership has become significantly older than that of the population... Renewing and reforming aspects of our institutional life is a necessary but far from sufficient response to the challenges facing the Church of England... The age profile of our clergy has also been increasing. Around 40 per cent of parish clergy are due to retire over the next decade or so.

However, Sarah Mullally, the fourth woman chosen to become a bishop in the Church of England, insisted in June 2015 that declining numbers at services should not necessarily be a cause of despair for churches because people will still "encounter God" without ever taking their place in a pew, saying that people might hear the Christian message through social media sites such as Facebook or in a café run as a community project.[21]

In 2015 the Church of England admitted that it was embarrassed to be paying staff under the living wage. The Church of England had previously campaigned for all employers to pay this minimum amount. The archbishop acknowledged it was not the only area where the church "fell short of its standards".[22]

The canon law of the Church of England identifies the Christian scriptures as the source of its doctrine. In addition, doctrine is also derived from the teachings of the Church Fathers and ecumenical councils (as well as the ecumenical creeds) in so far as these agree with scripture. This doctrine is expressed in the Thirty-Nine Articles of Religion, the Book of Common Prayer, and the Ordinal containing the rites for the ordination of deacons, priests, and the consecration of bishops.[23] Unlike other traditions, the Church of England has no single theologian that it can look to as a founder. However, Richard Hooker's appeal to scripture, church tradition, and reason as sources of authority continue to inform Anglican identity.[24]

The Church of England's doctrinal character today is largely the result of the Elizabethan Settlement, which sought to establish a comprehensive middle way between Roman Catholicism and Protestantism. The Church of England affirms the Protestant Reformation principle that scripture contains all things necessary to salvation and is the final arbiter in doctrinal matters. The Thirty-nine Articles are the church's only official confessional statement. Though not a complete system of doctrine, the articles highlight areas of agreement with Lutheran and Reformed positions, while differentiating Anglicanism from Roman Catholicism and Anabaptism.[24]

While embracing some themes of the Protestant Reformation, the Church of England also maintains Catholic traditions of the ancient church and teachings of the Church Fathers, unless these are considered contrary to scripture. It accepts the decisions of the first four ecumenical councils concerning the Trinity and the Incarnation. The Church of England also preserves Catholic order by adhering to episcopal polity, with ordained orders of bishops, priests and deacons. There are differences of opinion within the Church of England over the necessity of episcopacy. Some consider it essential, while others feel it is needed for the proper ordering of the church.[24]

The Church of England has, as one of its distinguishing marks, a breadth and "open-mindedness". This tolerance has allowed Anglicans who emphasise the Catholic tradition and others who emphasise the Reformed tradition to coexist. The three "parties" (see Churchmanship) in the Church of England are sometimes called high church (or Anglo-Catholic), low church (or Evangelical) and broad church (or liberal). The high church party places importance on the Church of England's continuity with the pre-Reformation Catholic Church, adherence to ancient liturgical usages and the sacerdotal nature of the priesthood. As their name suggests, Anglo-Catholics maintain many traditional Catholic practices and liturgical forms.[25] The low church party is more Protestant in both ceremony and theology.[26] Historically, broad church has been used to describe those of middle-of-the-road ceremonial preferences who lean theologically towards liberal Protestantism.[27] The balance between these strands of churchmanship is not static: in 2013, 40% of Church of England worshippers attended evangelical churches (compared with 26% in 1989), and 83% of very large congregations were evangelical. Such churches were also reported to attract higher numbers of men and young adults than others.[28]

The Church of England's official book of liturgy as established in English Law is the Book of Common Prayer. In addition to this book the General Synod has also legislated for a modern liturgical book, Common Worship, dating from 2000, which can be used as an alternative to the BCP. Like its predecessor, the 1980 Alternative Service Book, it differs from the Book of Common Prayer in providing a range of alternative services, mostly in modern language, although it does include some BCP-based forms as well, for example Order Two for Holy Communion. (This is a revision of the BCP service, altering some words and allowing the insertion of some other liturgical texts such as the Agnus Dei before communion.) The Order One rite follows the pattern of more modern liturgical scholarship.

The liturgies are organised according to the traditional liturgical year and the calendar of saints. The sacraments of baptism and the Eucharist are generally thought necessary to salvation. Infant baptism is practised. At a later age, individuals baptised as infants receive confirmation by a bishop, at which time they reaffirm the baptismal promises made by their parents or sponsors. The Eucharist, consecrated by a thanksgiving prayer including Christ's Words of Institution, is believed to be "a memorial of Christ's once-for-all redemptive acts in which Christ is objectively present and effectually received in faith".[29]

The use of hymns and music in the Church of England has changed dramatically over the centuries. Traditional Choral evensong is a staple of most cathedrals.[citation needed] The style of psalm chanting harks back to the Church of England's pre-reformation roots. During the 18th century, clergy such as Charles Wesley introduced their own styles of worship with poetic hymns.

In the latter half of the 20th century, the influence of the Charismatic Movement significantly altered the worship traditions of numerous Church of England parishes, primarily affecting those of evangelical persuasion. These churches now adopt a contemporary worship form of service, with minimal liturgical or ritual elements, and incorporating contemporary worship music.

Women were appointed as deaconesses from 1861 but they could not function fully as deacons and were not considered ordained clergy. Women have been lay readers for a long time. During the First World War, some women were appointed as lay readers, known as "bishop's messengers", who also led missions and ran churches in the absence of men. After that no more lay readers were appointed until 1969.

Legislation authorising the ordination of women as deacons was passed in 1986 and they were first ordained in 1987. The ordination of women as priests was passed by the General Synod in 1992 and began in 1994. In 2010, for the first time in the history of the Church of England, more women than men were ordained as priests (290 women and 273 men).[30]

In July 2005, the synod voted to "set in train" the process of allowing the consecration of women as bishops. In February 2006, the synod voted overwhelmingly for the "further exploration" of possible arrangements for parishes that did not want to be directly under the authority of a bishop who is a woman.[31] On 7 July 2008, the synod voted to approve the ordination of women as bishops and rejected moves for alternative episcopal oversight for those who do not accept the ministry of bishops who are women.[32] Actual ordinations of women to the episcopate required further legislation, which was narrowly rejected in a vote at General Synod in November 2012.[33][34]

On 20 November 2013, the General Synod voted overwhelmingly in support of a plan to allow the ordination of women as bishops, with 378 in favour, 8 against and 25 abstentions.[35]

On 14 July 2014, the General Synod approved the ordination of women as bishops. The House of Bishops recorded 37 votes in favour, two against with one abstention. The House of Clergy had 162 in favour, 25 against and four abstentions. The House of Laity voted 152 for, 45 against with five abstentions.[36] This legislation had to be approved by the Ecclesiastical Committee of the Parliament before it could be finally implemented at the November 2014 synod.

In December 2014, Libby Lane was announced as the first woman to become a bishop in the Church of England. She was consecrated as a bishop in January 2015.[37] [38]

In July 2015 Rachel Treweek was the first woman to become a diocesan bishop in the Church of England upon the confirmation of her election as Bishop of Gloucester.[39] She and Sarah Mullally, Bishop of Crediton, were the first women to be ordained as bishops at Canterbury Cathedral.[39]

The Church of England set up the Church Urban Fund in the 1980s to tackle poverty and deprivation. They see poverty as trapping individuals and communities with some people in urgent need. This leads to dependency, homelessness, hunger, isolation, low income, mental health problems, social exclusion, and violence. They feel poverty reduces confidence, reduces life expectancy people born in poor conditions have difficulty escaping.[40]

In parts of Liverpool, Manchester and Newcastle two-thirds of babies are born to poverty and have poorer life chances, also life expectancy 15 years lower than babies born in most fortunate communities. South Shore, Blackpool has lowest life expectancy at 66 years for men.[41]

The deep-rooted unfairness in our society is highlighted by these stark statistics. Children being born in this country, just a few miles apart, couldn't witness a more wildly differing start to life. In child poverty terms, we live in one of the most unequal countries in the western world. We want people to understand where their own community sits alongside neighbouring communities. The disparity is often shocking but it's crucial that, through greater awareness, people from all backgrounds come together to think about what could be done to support those born into poverty. [Paul Hackwood, the Chair of Trustees at Church Urban Fund][42]

Many prominent people in the Church of England have spoken out against poverty and welfare cuts in the United Kingdom. 27 Anglican bishop are among 43 Christian leaders who signed a letter that urge David Cameron to make sure people have enough to eat.

We often hear talk of hard choices. Surely few can be harder than that faced by the tens of thousands of older people who must 'heat or eat' each winter, harder than those faced by families whose wages have stayed flat while food prices have gone up 30% in just five years. Yet beyond even this we must, as a society, face up to the fact that over half of people using food banks have been put in that situation by cutbacks to and failures in the benefit system, whether it be payment delays or punitive sanctions.[43]

Benefit cuts, failures and "punitive sanctions" force thousands of UK citizens to use food banks. The campaign to end hunger considers this "truly shocking". and calls for a national day of fasting on 4 April 2014.[43]

Official figures from 2005 showed there were 25 million baptised Anglicans in England and Wales.[44] Due to its status as the established church, in general, anyone may be married, have their children baptised or their funeral in their local parish church, regardless of whether they are baptised or regular churchgoers.[45]

Between 1890 and 2001, churchgoing in the United Kingdom declined steadily.[46] In the years 1968 to 1999, Anglican Sunday church attendances almost halved, from 3.5 per cent of the population to just 1.9 per cent.[47] One study published in 2008 suggested that if current trends were to continue, Sunday attendances could fall to 350,000 in 2030 and just 87,800 in 2050.[48]

In 2011, the Church of England published statistics showing 1.7 million people attending at least one of its services each month, a level maintained since the turn of the millennium; approximately one million participating each Sunday and three million taking part in a Church of England service on Christmas Day or Christmas Eve. The church also claimed that 30% attend Sunday worship at least once a year; more than 40% attend a wedding in their local church and still more attend a funeral there.[49] Nationally the Church of England baptises one child in eight.[50]

The Church of England has 18,000 active ordained clergy and 10,000 licensed lay ministers.[51] In 2009, 491 people were recommended for ordination training, maintaining the level at the turn of the millennium, and 564 new clergy (266 women and 298 men) were ordained. More than half of those ordained (193 men and 116 women) were appointed to full-time paid ministry.[52] In 2011, 504 new clergy were ordained, including 264 to paid ministry, and 349 lay readers were admitted to ministry; and the mode age-range of those recommended for ordination training had remained 40–49 since 1999.[53]

Article XIX ('Of the Church') of the 39 Articles defines the church as follows:

The visible Church of Christ is a congregation of faithful men, in which the pure Word of God is preached, and the sacraments be duly ministered according to Christ's ordinance in all those things that of necessity are requisite to the same.[54]

The British monarch has the constitutional title of Supreme Governor of the Church of England. The canon law of the Church of England states, "We acknowledge that the Queen's most excellent Majesty, acting according to the laws of the realm, is the highest power under God in this kingdom, and has supreme authority over all persons in all causes, as well ecclesiastical as civil."[55] In practice this power is often exercised through Parliament and the Prime Minister.

The Church of Ireland and the Church in Wales separated from the Church of England in 1869[56] and 1920[57] respectively and are autonomous churches in the Anglican Communion; Scotland's national church, the Church of Scotland, is Presbyterian but the Scottish Episcopal Church is in the Anglican Communion.[58]

In addition to England, the jurisdiction of the Church of England extends to the Isle of Man, the Channel Islands and a few parishes in Flintshire, Monmouthshire and Radnorshire in Wales.[59] Expatriate congregations on the continent of Europe have become the Diocese of Gibraltar in Europe.

Parish is the most local level, often consisting of one church building and community, although many parishes are joining forces in a variety of ways for financial reasons. The parish is looked after by a parish priest who for historical or legal reasons may be called by one of the following offices: vicar, rector, priest in charge, team rector, team vicar. The first, second, and fourth of these may also be known as the 'incumbent'. The running of the parish is the joint responsibility of the incumbent and the Parochial Church Council (PCC), which consists of the parish clergy and elected representatives from the congregation. The Diocese of Gibraltar in Europe is not formally divided into parishes.

There are a number of local churches that do not have a parish. In urban areas there are a number of proprietary chapels (mostly built in the 19th century to cope with urbanisation and growth in population). Also in more recent years there are increasingly church plants and fresh expressions of church, whereby new congregations are planted in locations such as schools or pubs to spread the Gospel of Christ in non-traditional ways.

Archdeaconry, e.g., the seven in the Diocese of Gibraltar in Europe. This is the area under the jurisdiction of an archdeacon. It consists of a number of deaneries.
Diocese, e.g., Diocese of Durham, Diocese of Guildford, Diocese of St Albans. This is the area under the jurisdiction of a diocesan bishop, e.g., the Bishops of Durham, Guildford and St Albans, and will have a cathedral. There may be one or more assisting bishops, usually called suffragan bishops, within the diocese who assist the diocesan bishop in his ministry, e.g., in Guildford diocese, the Bishop of Dorking. In some very large dioceses a legal measure has been enacted to create "episcopal areas", where the diocesan bishop runs one such area himself and appoints "area bishops" to run the other areas as mini-dioceses, legally delegating many of his powers to the area bishops. Dioceses with episcopal areas include London, Chelmsford, Oxford, Chichester, Southwark, and Lichfield. The bishops work with an elected body of lay and ordained representatives, known as the Diocesan Synod, to run the diocese. A diocese is subdivided into a number of archdeaconries.
Province, i.e., Canterbury or York. This is the area under the jurisdiction of an archbishop, i.e. the Archbishops of Canterbury and York. Decision-making within the province is the responsibility of the General Synod (see also above). A province is subdivided into dioceses.
Primacy, i.e., Church of England. In addition to his specific authority in his own province, each archbishop is "Primate of All England" (Canterbury) or "Primate of England" (York) and has powers that extend over the whole country—for example his license to marry without the banns (marriage licence).
Royal Peculiar, a small number of churches more closely associated with the Crown, and a very few with the law and are outside the usual church hierarchy though conforming to the rite. These are outside episcopal jurisdiction.

All rectors and vicars are appointed by patrons, who may be private individuals, corporate bodies such as cathedrals, colleges or trusts, or by the bishop or directly by the Crown. No clergy can be instituted and inducted into a parish without swearing the Oath of Allegiance to Her Majesty, and taking the Oath of Canonical Obedience "in all things lawful and honest" to the bishop. Usually they are instituted to the benefice by the bishop and then inducted by the archdeacon into the possession of the benefice property—church and parsonage. Curates (assistant clergy) are appointed by rectors and vicars, or if priests-in-charge by the bishop after consultation with the patron. Cathedral clergy (normally a dean and a varying number of residentiary canons who constitute the cathedral chapter) are appointed either by the Crown, the bishop, or by the dean and chapter themselves. Clergy officiate in a diocese either because they hold office as beneficed clergy or are licensed by the bishop when appointed, or simply with permission.

The most senior bishop of the Church of England is the Archbishop of Canterbury, who is the metropolitan of the southern province of England, the Province of Canterbury. He has the status of Primate of All England. He is the focus of unity for the worldwide Anglican Communion of independent national or regional churches. Justin Welby has been Archbishop of Canterbury since the confirmation of his election on 4 February 2013.[60]

The second most senior bishop is the Archbishop of York, who is the metropolitan of the northern province of England, the Province of York. For historical reasons (relating to the time of York's control by the Danes) he is referred to as the Primate of England. John Sentamu became Archbishop of York in 2005. The Bishop of London, the Bishop of Durham and the Bishop of Winchester are ranked in the next three positions.

The process of appointing diocesan bishops is complex and is handled by the Crown Nominations Committee which submits names to the Prime Minister (acting on behalf of the Crown) for consideration.

The Church of England has a legislative body, the General Synod. Synod can create two types of legislation, measures and canons. Measures have to be approved but cannot be amended by the British Parliament before receiving the Royal Assent and becoming part of the law of England.[61] Although it is the established church in England only, its measures must be approved by both Houses of Parliament including the non-English members. Canons require Royal Licence and Royal Assent, but form the law of the church, rather than the law of the land.[62]

Another assembly is the Convocation of the English Clergy, which is older than the General Synod and its predecessor the Church Assembly. By the 1969 Synodical Government Measure almost all of the Convocations' functions were transferred to the General Synod. Additionally, there are Diocesan Synods and deanery synods, which are the governing bodies of the divisions of the Church.

Of the 42 diocesan archbishops and bishops in the Church of England, 26 are permitted to sit in the House of Lords. The Archbishops of Canterbury and York automatically have seats, as do the Bishops of London, Durham and Winchester. The remaining 21 seats are filled in order of seniority by consecration. It may take a diocesan bishop a number of years to reach the House of Lords, at which point he becomes a Lord Spiritual. The Bishop of Sodor and Man and the Bishop of Gibraltar in Europe are not eligible to sit in the House of Lords as their dioceses lie outside the United Kingdom.[63]

Although an established church, the Church of England does not receive any direct government support. Donations comprise its largest source of income, and it also relies heavily on the income from its various historic endowments. In 2005, the Church of England had estimated total outgoings of around £900 million.[64]

The Church of England manages an investment portfolio which is worth more than £8000 million.[65]

The Church of England supports an online directory of churches with the name "A Church Near You". A user-edited resource, it currently lists 16,400 churches and has 7,000 editors in 42 dioceses.[66] The directory enables parishes to maintain accurate location, contact and event information which is shared with other websites and mobile apps. In 2012 the directory formed the data backbone of "Christmas Near You"[67] and in 2014 was used to promote harvest events with the church's "Harvest Near You" initiative.[68]

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20.Jump up ^ "Church of England cannot carry on as it is unless decline 'urgently' reversed – Welby and Sentamu", The Daily Telegraph, 12 January 2015.
21.Jump up ^ "Empty pews not the end of the world, says Church of England's newest bishop", The Daily Telegraph, 9 June 2015.
22.Jump up ^ "Church of England: Justin Welby says low pay 'embarrassing'". BBC News.
23.Jump up ^ Canon A5. Canons of the Church of England.
24.^ Jump up to: a b c Massey H. Shepherd, Jr. and Dale B. Martin, "Anglicanism" in Encyclopedia of Religion, vol. 1, 2nd. ed., edited by Lindsay Jones (Detroit:Macmillan Reference USA, 2005), pp. 349–350.
25.Jump up ^ "High Church", New Catholic Encyclopedia, 2nd ed., vol. 6 (Detroit: Gale, 2003), pp. 823–824.
26.Jump up ^ "Low Church", New Catholic Encyclopedia, 2nd ed., vol. 8 (Detroit: Gale, 2003), p. 836.
27.Jump up ^ E. McDermott, "Broad Church", New Catholic Encyclopedia, 2nd ed., vol. 2 (Detroit: Gale, 2003), pp. 624–625.
28.Jump up ^ 'New Directions', May 2013
29.Jump up ^ Shepherd, Jr. and Martin, "Anglicanism", p. 350.
30.Jump up ^ "More new women priests than men for first time". The Daily Telegraph. 4 February 2012. Retrieved 11 July 2012.
31.Jump up ^ Church votes overwhelmingly for compromise on women bishops – news from. Ekklesia.
32.Jump up ^ "Church will ordain women bishops". BBC News. 7 July 2008. Retrieved 7 July 2008.
33.Jump up ^ Pigott, Robert. (14 February 2009) Synod struggles on women bishops. BBC News.
34.Jump up ^ "Church of England general synod votes against women bishops", BBC News, 20 November 2012.
35.Jump up ^ "Church of England Synod votes overwhelmingly in support of women bishops". The Descrier. 20 November 2013. Retrieved 20 November 2013.
36.Jump up ^ "LIVE: Vote backs women bishops". BBC. 14 July 2014. Retrieved 14 July 2014.
37.Jump up ^ ITN News. "The Church of England names its first female bishop – Video Dailymotion". Dailymotion.
38.Jump up ^ "After turmoil, Church of England consecrates first woman bishop". Reuters.
39.^ Jump up to: a b First female diocesan bishop in C of E consecrated. Anglicannews.org. Retrieved on 23 July 2015.
40.Jump up ^ About Church Urban Fund
41.Jump up ^ "Church Urban Fund finds 'poorest' in north-west England". BBC News.
42.Jump up ^ "Child poverty in the UK". Church of England News.
43.^ Jump up to: a b Church of England bishops demand action over hunger
44.Jump up ^ "Catholicism set to be UK's top religion". Metro News.
45.Jump up ^ See the pages linked from the Life Events page on the Church of England website
46.Jump up ^ Peter J. Bowler, Reconciling science and religion: the debate in early-twentieth-century Britain (University of Chicago Press, 2001), page 194.
47.Jump up ^ Robin Gill, The Empty Church Revisited, (Ashgate Publishing, 2003) page 161.
48.Jump up ^ Christian Research, Religious Trends (2008), cited in Ruth Gledhill, "Churchgoing on its knees as Christianity falls out of favour", The Times, 8 May 2008.
49.Jump up ^ Church of England website. Churchofengland.org.
50.Jump up ^ Church of England website. (PDF).
51.Jump up ^ Church of England Research & Statistics link page. Churchofengland.org (9 May 2012).
52.Jump up ^ Facts and stats. Churchofengland.org.
53.Jump up ^ Church of England Year Book, 2012
54.Jump up ^ 39 Articles – 19–22. Church Society.
55.Jump up ^ Canon A 7 "Of the Royal Supremacy"
56.Jump up ^ "Irish Church Act 1869". Parliament of the United Kingdom. Retrieved 10 October 2012.
57.Jump up ^ "Our Heritage: Facing Difficulties". Church in Wales website. Retrieved 10 October 2012.
58.Jump up ^ "History: The Revolution". Scottish Episcopal Church website. Retrieved 10 October 2012.
59.Jump up ^ Cross, F. L. (ed.) (1957) Oxford Dictionary of the Christian Church; p. 1436
60.Jump up ^ "Justin Welby becomes Archbishop of Canterbury". BBC News.
61.Jump up ^ "Summary of Church Assembly and General Synod Measures". Church of England website. Archbishops' council of the Church of England. November 2007.
62.Jump up ^ "General Synod". Church of England website. Archbishops' council of the Church of England.
63.Jump up ^ House of Lords: alphabetical list of Members. Retrieved 12 December 2008.
64.Jump up ^ outgoings. Cofe.anglican.org.
65.Jump up ^ "Citing ethics, Anglicans sell stake in News Corp" by Eric Pfanner, The New York Times, 8 August 2012.
66.Jump up ^ "A Church Near You Help". achurchnearyou.com. A Church Near You. Retrieved 25 December 2015.
67.Jump up ^ Christmas Near You Announcement Accessed: 6 August 2014
68.Jump up ^ Harvest Near You announcement, Accessed 6 August 2014.

Further reading

Garbett, Cyril, Abp. The Church of England Today. London: Hodder and Stoughton, 1953. 128 p.
Hodges, J. P. The Nature of the Lion: Elizabeth I and Our Anglican Heritage. London: Faith Press, 1962. 153 pp.
Picton, Hervé. A Short History of the Church of England: From the Reformation to the Present Day. Newcastle upon Tyne: Cambridge Scholars Publishing, 2015. 180 p.
Rowlands, John Henry Lewis. Church, State, and Society, 1827–1845: the Attitudes of John Keble, Richard Hurrell Froude, and John Henry Newman. Worthing, Eng.: P. Smith [of] Churchman Publishing; Folkestone, Eng.: distr. ... by Bailey Book Distribution, 1989. xi, 262 p. ISBN 1-85093-132-1

​

 

Carol


Carol
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• Post n°51

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

Carol Today at 4:58 pm

Oxy, you're a self-professed scholar who has spent countless hours studying your areas of interest. We learn from you about what you post but something mudra commented about you stuck with me.. we're not in your league to discuss what you bring up because we don't have your wealth of intellectual knowledge to even begin to comment. Meaning I get over-whelmed as my goal these past years is to empty the mind and live in the "present." Many of your questions are speculations: What if? Which means it doesn't matter how many hours I may devote to answering some of them in the past on some of your threads.. you just come back with more questions.

Now let me throw this one back at you. What if I no longer believe in the bible or religion and just view all of it as information written by "men" as a means to control and manipulate the general populace allowing them to situate themselves in positions of power, control and greed? What if I don't care any more about what any of these "men" had to write or document as my primary concern is the present moment in time, not the past? What if I view all of the retoric as a waste of my precious time along with being a distraction from my true work on this planet? What if I've already put all of that behind me and am in alignment with what mudra posts in this thread?

What if you can't accept you're a self-made scholar looking for others like you to discuss some of the insights you've come up with in your self-educational process? What if you can't find satisfaction in simple exchanges and just wish to expand ever more deeply into what you wish to share?

We can all learn from the information you bring forth Oxy. Can you be satisfied with that?



_________________
What is life?
It is the flash of a firefly in the night, the breath of a buffalo in the wintertime. It is the little shadow which runs across the grass and loses itself in the sunset.
With deepest respect ~ Aloha & Mahalo, Carol

 

orthodoxymoron

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Posts: 6685
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• Post n°52

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

orthodoxymoron Today at 6:04 pm

Thank-you for your response, Carol. I completely understand what you said. I keep saying that a lot of what I do on this website is an act. I'm not like this in "real-life". I simply think there are closed-door meetings of agents, theologians, politicians, scientists, scholars, ET's, angels, demons, et al -- who candidly talk about what I hint-at. I think some of them are probably nervous regarding what I post -- yet I suspect that they quickly calm-down when no-one seems to care-about or comprehend what I'm presenting. I simply think there is a level of solar system administration which would shock just about everyone. I think I've spoken directly with several individuals who know the "Whole-Story" yet were pretty tight-lipped and poker-faced when I asked them difficult-questions. The "Ancient Egyptian Deity" kept answering "You Know I Can't Tell You That!" I don't know if they were Angelic or Demonic -- or if they were some sort of Hybrid-Android or Ex Machina!! I keep suspecting an ancient conflict between Gabriel and Michael -- with "Lucifer" being a "Fall-Guy" term, which might be directed at BOTH Gabriel and Michael -- depending upon one's loyalties and perspectives. I keep suggesting that Michael ruled Ancient-Earth -- but was replaced by Gabriel several thousand years ago -- for better or worse, I know not. I also keep suggesting that there has been a One Solar System Government for thousands (or millions) of years -- for better or worse, I know not. I keep suspecting that things are SO Bad, that it is somehow necessary to rule mankind by secrecy, deception, and violence -- and that open and honest governance might REALLY screw things up. Finally, I have suggested the possibility that the Original-Administrator and Governmental-System will be reinstated in or around 2133 A.D. (partially based upon an unorthodox and somewhat-weak interpretation of the Book of Daniel). I don't think the City-States are run by a bunch of Greedy Old-Men. I think these guys are puppets and middle-men for REALLY Bad@$$ Galactic Movers and Shakers who aren't very-nice. That old Bill Ryan interview with that London-Guy (with his back to the camera) continues to haunt me. I think there might be a lot of truth to that. The Religious and Political Science-Fiction I create in my head would probably drive most people (and other-than-people) completely-insane. I keep wondering if I was somehow in the middle of some REALLY Nasty Galactic Power-Struggles in other-lives and other solar-systems??!! That wouldn't surprise me one little bit. It might also explain why I'm such a Completely Ignorant Fool in this particular incarnation. I might have a hell of a lot of enemies -- both seen and unseen -- going way, way, way back. The Horror.

​

Carol


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• Post n°53

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

Carol Today at 7:41 pm

That is one of the qualities I like about you Oxy. You allow yourself to become immersed in "wonderland" on a regular basis. Your like Alice who fell down the rabbit hole and is trying to describe to the rest of us what you're discovering along your journey.

We don't know what we don't know. Maybe we should do a little past life regression on you to see what you come up with?



_________________
What is life?
It is the flash of a firefly in the night, the breath of a buffalo in the wintertime. It is the little shadow which runs across the grass and loses itself in the sunset.
With deepest respect ~ Aloha & Mahalo, Carol

 

orthodoxymoron

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• Post n°54

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

orthodoxymoron Today at 3:51 am
Carol, I won't do regression-hypnosis, OBE's, drugs, channeling, engaged, married, organized-crime, disorganized-crime, organized-religion, disorganized-religion, mind-control, or secret-societies -- and I don't even attend church (primarily because I wish to remain as objective as possible). I suspect that some regression-hypnosis involves manipulation and deception by nefarious-regressives (superimposing their imaginations upon their weak-minded victims). I'm probably much too open to the experiences and claims of others -- but I prefer to vicariously experience the experiences of others (rather than personally doing anything mysterious and spooky). What Would The Addams Family Say??

The Mists of Avalon Unveiled​

 

Carol


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• Post n°55

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

Carol Today at 10:42 am




_________________
What is life?
It is the flash of a firefly in the night, the breath of a buffalo in the wintertime. It is the little shadow which runs across the grass and loses itself in the sunset.
With deepest respect ~ Aloha & Mahalo, Carol


Spregovori

Spregovori
Posts: 71
Join date: 2010-04-09

• Post n°56

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

Spregovori Today at 3:20 pm
@Carol

I need a label to attach several meanings and examples to it. Makes things easier.

mudra wrote:​

Spregovori ,

Exuse me if I don't copy paste your last post here for it is quite a long one and what comes to mind reading it is related to the different ideas you expressed in it.​

It is actually better you do not do that. Unless you reply to each specific part you only quote what is needed or nothing at all.




@mudra, @Sanicle


They are the traits of the dominant animal on this planet (unless you count the supposed underground dwellers).

What exactly we are is a broad and often very misunderstood subject, more or less generalized and rarely properly argumented.

The core essence of reality human is this...(i made a quick "drawing"...should be good enough)

A





B


​

A: this is me as being and my behavior, traits (as in personal traits) and wishes are part of me. i am my behavior, i am my traits, i am my wishes.

B: me as being is one thing. what i do, the traits i have, the desires i have are not a part of me but i am responsible for all of them, yet none of that equals who i am, my personal self worth.


When A is successful in something it concludes "i am worthy", but when it makes an error, when it notices some sort of a defect about itself, when its desire (expectation) is not realized...then A gets to feel bad, hurt, insulted, inferior, depressed...

B will say, I am worthy. I know i can and do good in life and can (will) fulfill some of my desires and have traits which serve me well. At the same time i know i can make an error, i know i am not perfect and that i can not always get what i want, yet that does not make me a bad or less worthy person.

A: when mommy and daddy say i am good i feel worthy, when i get a lollipop i asked for i am worthy...if not, them i am not worthy. A is a rational of a child and sadly of so many grown men and women.

B: is what is to be a rational of a responsible adult


If he/she does not do what i desire, he/she does not love me.

A: He did not align the table napkin with the corners and he "knows" how much that matters, therefore, he must not love me (enough).

A: She keeps coming late in-spite of "knowing" what a busy man i am and how my time is important, therefore, she must not love me (enough).

There is no love btw. There are only people who [give] love and are being loved.

Love by itself is A. Giving and receiving is B, it implies responsibility and many many things which come along with it. Love by itself (A) implies expectations...as in..."it will be ok, we love each other". Yet, love by itself, is not enough.

Btw while this might seem to be grossly off topic (not that it is the only post in this thread) it is actually not...you can relate this to thuban, to those who were "spreading the word about it" and those who were "reacting" to that.


Carol


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• Post n°57

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

Carol Today at 5:12 pm

Actually this doesn't fit into the way I experience the world or my life. Love is a constant that one is open to or not.. yet it is a consciousness, intelligence, frequency that holds matter together.

When awake, at will I can turn the direct "feeling" experience of love on or off. If I choose to experience love at the source level I focus on the heart chakra.

Something else I noticed is that when my husband is talking and I'm resting in another room, the sound of his voice makes my heart quiver. There is a physical vibrational resonance frequency response that exist between us that is felt in both directions. So we are connected by an energy source that transcends the intellectual mind.

What I see you doing is compartmentalizing the experience of love at an intellectual level missing out on how we are all connected at an energetic level that may or may not have anything to do with one's behavior.



_________________
What is life?
It is the flash of a firefly in the night, the breath of a buffalo in the wintertime. It is the little shadow which runs across the grass and loses itself in the sunset.
With deepest respect ~ Aloha & Mahalo, Carol

 

SuiGeneris

SuiGeneris
Posts: 1221
Join date: 2010-04-09
Location: Gaia

• Post n°58

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

SuiGeneris Yesterday at 11:55 pm
orthodoxymoron on Fri Nov 19, 2010 4:32 pm

orthodoxymoron wrote:
Is 'Tony' simply a facilitator? I'm going to spend some quality time on his site. It seems to make a lot more sense than 'his' posts on the Thuban Q&A.
Oxy, notice this question you asked yourself 6 years ago.

Now you finally have your answer.

The following excerpt is from the Wes Penre papers:

Normally, when we ask the source a question, they look in the memory bank of the vehicles (the channeler), which often go back thousands and thousands of years due to the genetic memories from previous life, and they look in the Akashic Records for an answer, in case they don't know it already. Bashar (one of these sources) explains it pretty well when he says that the Akashic Records are not, like many think, some sort of "library in the sky" where you have to go to find the answer. The Records are all around us in the ether; it's there to immediately pick up and use.
Then apparently, according to some sources (something I was not aware of), such as Harone (who is a Gray whom Lyssa Royale channels), these entities are using computer systems to gather their thoughts so that they become transmittable. Harone says:
"Emotions on my end are not necessary to channel, though I am working with physical facilitators on my end [Bashar and Sasha] and the three of us are linked into a computer device [my emphasis] that will synthesize our thoughts. They provide a balance for my thoughts so that the biological vehicle can receive them. Thus they are translated."[7]
Bashar is of a Gray species as well, while Sasha is supposedly a Pleiadian. In the above case the computer was apparently used in order to combine the thoughts of these three very different species (is that really necessary?) and make sense of it to humans, but if this is true, it makes me wonder how often channeled sources (called only "sources" from here on) use computers when answering questions that humans.
http://wespenre.com/3/paper02-in-wait-for-things-to-come.htm#7


facilitator's first post on AV1 wrote:

<<"I am introducing myself here from the 12th dimension, that is I do not reside in the physical universe of space and time, but I shall enter this universe simultaneously with the transformation of this planet of the cosmic humanoids called Earth or Gaia or Terra or Akashia, but known as Serpentina the Mother of the Dragons, by many extraterrestrial sentiences.
Even more, as 'Hunab Ku's' Beloved, Gaia will be able to transform her galactic consciousness into Cosmic-Universal Consciousness through and by the opening of the 12th dimension and our entry into universal consciousness as the creator race of the universes as something I shall label for the moment as the Council of Thuban."
In the Honour of the Dragons
Sirebard Beardris>>
*********************************************************

Xeia


SuiGeneris


SuiGeneris
Posts: 1221
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• Post n°59

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

SuiGeneris Yesterday at 11:59 pm

Sanicle wrote:
I apologize if I've said anything to offend or upset you Sui.

If you did i missed it. I don't know what you mean.



SuiGeneris


SuiGeneris
Posts: 1221
Join date: 2010-04-09
Location: Gaia

• Post n°60

Re: My Liberation from the Thuban Sex Cult

SuiGeneris Today at 12:01 am

I don't understand the bald heads on post 50. can someone explain?


Xeia